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... as opposed to a very narrow focused-type job. '''Butler:''' Great. Talking about the training, and you talked about how the Shuttle was still being built, basically, when you were starting, and ... can get a little crowded. But, no, nothing particular. '''Butler:''' And how about on return? We didn't talk about that with your first flight, but how did you adapt upon return ... . Really, the adaptation on the first flight is long. It takes probably about three hours going up and about twenty-four hours coming back. After you've been up there, that's ...

... and down again. Well, it was before then that they were talking about NACA or the government was talking about creating the Space Task Group. Now, when I was doing all this ... him when he could do this. He said, “It would take me about eight or nine months.” I said, “How about six?” and he said, “I can’t do it in six ... who were managing the project, I think, for the Eastman Kodak Company. What intrigued me about the Orbiter was that it used an onboard processing technique. It was launched. Just five ...

... of thing. Politics. It's one of the unfortunate things about life. You have these political groups in between. '''Butler:''' Talking about relations, and having mentioned Buzz Aldrin, how were relations between ... missions I worked. That was the fun part. Then some nonsense about real estate. But I only lasted at that about six months or so. To heck with that. So when my ... in there and met some of the people and talked with them and learned about it. They learned about my background and immediately wanted to suck me into their world of activity ...

... as my deputy for space science in the directorate. He stayed there for about a year or so. Talk about a fish out of water. Laughter Poor Jim didn't quite know ... remote-sensing arena. How can we use space to remove the required data about the Earth and do something about Earth management and environmental sciences and the like? So I got a ... commercialization of LANDSAT. Unfortunately, the Deputy Secretary of Commerce had some discussions with COMSAT management about where this program should go, and it was supposed to go on a competitive basis ...

... magazines like Air Trails…As you read those every day and you learned… many statistics about various airplane s …such as weight, horsepower, armament, flight characteristics, etc. …This interest…grew. Then ... I would say something, because I think he had a little bit of concern about some things about the control system. Honeywell had proposed what really…was…the first digital control system ... I remember distinctly one particular one I guess I can talk about it…It was TRW, and they were talking about an advanced satellite for the Air Force and they wanted to ...

... . So the way this rocket engine worked is you had a big flat plate about this big around, about this thick, and then the engine bell is around that. This is the ... a minute ago, about half the failures, you never thought about them. Half the solutions you didn't think about ahead of time. You evolved to them after you thought about it. Once they ... next time, if there's something that you think I failed to talk about, we should have talked about— '''Rusnak:''' All right. Yes, I don't want to keep you any more ...

... 't astrophysicists or astronomers or something like that. We had to learn about what the experiment was all about and why it was being done in order to be a competent performer ... . We found that a lot of the PIs principle investigators knew nothing about human factors and they knew nothing about being weightless, so they would prescribe things to be done that just ... bag and he barfed into his bag. So then we started talking about what we were going to do about it. The day before we left JSC, the doctors had come in ...

... refused to take the bait. George said, "I don't know enough about Mars to make an opinion about it. I'll tell you when we get there." But that lunar quarantine ... there were fatalities in those chambers, and the medical people kept reminding the engineering community about those fires, and the engineering community kept saying, "Just tend to your physiology, Doc. We ... it with us. '''Catterson:''' I could go on for days about it. '''Butler:''' Well, we could go on for days hearing about it. '''Catterson:''' But definitely worthwhile. '''Butler:''' Definitely. End of interview ...

... and I, all of us don't fully understand about the creation of the universe, about the miracle of life itself. I thought about that, and as I say, it was a nostalgic ... good times together, and we used to talk about things privately that they would never talk about publicly. We'd talk about religion, we'd talk about Cuba, and he told me a lot ... in the '60s and '70s. That's a sad commentary. We've been talking about it, thinking about it, planning -- we're not going to land on the Moon until 2020. Now ...

... Rockwell when I retired, and they discussed these various things about SAIL and so forth, it said about "this weird guy who talks about girls in red and blue stockings." Now, I don ... without that if that—yes, let's talk about the—well, we'll do that later, talk about the Space Station. I can talk now about jobs after NASA? '''Rusnak:''' Yes. '''Chambers:''' After ... , where they had the computer failures— '''Chambers:''' No, I don't know anything about that. I read about it, just what was in the newspapers. '''Rusnak:''' Looking back on your career as ...

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